[Bf-vfx] VFX related stuff that I think could be improved

[Bartek Skorupa (priv)]

Transform controls:
After a second thought I'd agree that having separate node(s) for transformations is ok and yes, it makes the chain clearer.
However I still don't see anything wrong in ability to make those transformations directly in canvas having instant response to the performed action. If too much computing power is needed to render whole image that quickly, no problem: outline of the image could be drawn and render could go after finishing transformations. I mean something like "adaptive resolution" or so. Render fast what you can in "real time" even if in some cases it's limited to showing just outlines and then render the rest.

I also agree with the approach to opacity. That's right. It's not a transform property, so it should be separated from transformations themselves. In such case I'd say that it's not needed. Factors and alpha controls that we have right now are enough to do anything we need.

> I didn't understand what you mean with "the right place for adding masks should just be the compositor window"
I mean this:
Think about the moment when you decide that you need the mask. It's during compositing, right? I realize that masking is needed, so I want to add mask. The first thing that comes to my mind intuitively is that I need to add node for this and then control its properties, i.e. the shape of the mask,
So shift-A, mask (being all the time in compositing window/panel) and my canvas is automatically ready for creating this mask.
When I want to modify the mask I simply select the proper node and modify the mask defined by this node.
If I want to have new mask that is just a bit different than the existing one, I duplicate the node representing this mask and automatically have its copy.
I hope I made myself a bit clearer, but if not, please let me know, I'll try to explain it differently.

> I didn't get this ... Are you saying that Bezier Warp or mesh warp aren't useful because a simple distort node would be enough?
No. I mean that bezier or mesh warp are needed AND different approach to "movie distortion" node would be nice as well.
In this one paragraph I mentioned two different matters:
1. It would be great to have warping/reshaping possibilities.
2. When talking about "movie distortion" it should be possible to apply  it without having any movie clip in your file. If I have a movie clip I can use it, but if I don't, I'd like to be able to manually enter K1, K2 and K3 values in the node properties themselves.
Lens distortion node gives slightly different results than movie distortion node, so I'd like to have them both, but a bit better control over movie distortion.

Bartek Skorupa

Sent from my iPhone

On 7 wrz 2013, at 16:55, Francesco Paglia <f.paglia.80 at gmail.com> wrote:

> some comment inlined:
>  
>> 2. Canvas:
>> Some users love backdrop. I hate it. For me canvas is a separate window. Let it be the UV image editor, I don't care. I believe I'll hear different opinions here.
> 
> I don't care of backdrop and most of time I just leave it off but I think many people do use it because they perceive a quick visual relation between the node editing and the on screen feedback. I believe that if node editing is moved away from the node itself the backdrop will lose its value as well.
> Let me say moving controls outside the node will just improve compositing user experience with a faster and more efficient workflow.
> 
> Let me add that I perfectly agree in the rationalization of image viewer... there are too many, each of which specialized for a special purpose...
>  
>> Anyway:
>> a) Ctrl-Shift-click should automatically switch UV image editor to "Viewer Node".
> 
> That's a nice thought! +1  
> 
>  
>> b) Transform controls:
>> This should simply be easy. I personally don't see the need for all those "Translate", "Rotate" etc nodes. IMHO Anchor Point, Position, Rotation and Scale should just be the properties of every node. "Opacity" would also be nice.
>> I make the node active, hover the mouse over "canvas", hit "R" and rotate. just like objects in 3D View. Hit "S" and scale. Just imagine: Select, hover, "SXX", move a bit, click, done. Image gets resized along "local" X just a bit. How much? As much as needed. You simply watch what you are doing and do it.
>> Additional gizmos in canvas would also be nice. Just click the gizmo and move the image, rotate or scale, do it with Ctrl or whatever other key to constrain proportions… I'm in heaven :-)
>> Those gizmos could control the active node's output. Just that simple.
>> I should also be able to enter numeric values of those properties in Properties panel of the node.
>> … and pleeeeeeeeease give us the Anchor Point. It's important to be able to rotate or scale around different point than the center of the image.
> 
> A node based compositor doesn't necessary work on image offset/rotation that's why a transform node is useful. The way AE works it's quite different from the node base approach.
> Personally I find much more useful to get to the right result and once I need a transform node I just add it in the right place of my chain... How many times people create a precomposition of a precomposition of a composition that at the end becomes part of another composition just because is faster than connect the transformation of many layers via scripts or because the timeline is getting too full of layers..
> In my opinion having nodes that explicitly tell me what they do is a much cleaner workflow.
> Of course I agree on the rationalization of the nodes: a single transform node with all the proprieties inside could be enough and the anchor point must be one of them!
> 
> Opacity is a kind of property that is related to color not offset so it has to be part of another node (a color correction node or an opacity node could fit perfectly)
>   
>> 
>> 3. Masks:
>> Well… I simply don't know how on earth one can effectively use those crazy controls. It takes ages to draw simple shapes. Bezier curves with easy control of handles right after placing a point is the only option IMHO. Sorry for mentioning After Effects once again, but there I simply click and the point gets added. Then without releasing the mouse I drag and the handle gets defined. It's intuitive and easy. You don't think, you just draw.
>> In my opinion the right place for adding masks should just be the compositor window.
>> Shift-A, add mask, move the mouse over canvas and do the magic.
>> Select more than one mask nodes and you can control them simultaneously. How about that?
> 
> I didn't understand what you mean with "the right place for adding masks should just be the compositor window" but I agree that the workflow can be simplified and even AE is easier that blender I think other solution are even better..... but it's my opinion! :)
>  
>> 
>> 4. Color display when alpha different than 1.0:
>> I don't know why it's done this way. Every pixel has R, G, B and A values. Why when I disable alpha display I can't see the colors as they are? In order to see the real values (and look) of the image in semi-transparent or transparent areas I have to do all the premultiply, unpremultiply, unprepremutipremultidivide-setalpha-unsetalpha magic just to see the colors. It drives me crazy. I'd simply want to see the RGB values of transparent pixels. It used to be this way some ages ago. Why did it change?
> 
> Premultiply / unpremultiply nodes are very important in general but i agree that a "display color only" should avoid (or at list could if it can be treated as an option) the alpha multiplication since the meaning of color only should be exactly this.
> 
>  
>> 
>> 5. Several new "distortion" nodes would be a great help. Something like: "Corner Pin", "Bezier Warp", "Mesh Warp", "Spherize" etc. plus "Movie Distorsion" where I could simply enter the values without having any movie clip. Why do I need this? I would simply like to distort some image using predefined distortion values.
> I didn't get this ... Are you saying that Bezier Warp or mesh warp aren't useful because a simple distort node would be enough?
> 
>  
>> 6. Overscan: Well… What more can I say. It's crutial to be able to render larger image just to crop it after distortion. I have my workaround for this, but having a simple option in render settings would be great.
> 
> Let me add an extra thought, I think the compositor should not replicate the power of animating and editing stuff of the 3D side of the work where we can animate every single layer.
> IMHO it should be not so strictly related to the renderlayer system and it should be used to make  all the 2D image process we need.
> It should be possible to create as many node tree as we want and add them as 2d image input on every 3d Object (of course we should be able to link a node tree to the final render output as well), this will solve dozen of limitation we have now and will avoid the need of using many transform node ;)
> 
> Ciao
> Francesco  
> 
> -- 
> Francesco Paglia
> Vfx and Production Supervisor
> 
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