[Bf-committers] Blender 2.8 - the Workflow release

Mon Jul 20 20:48:26 CEST 2015

I'm excited to see what Lukas writes about asset management and external 
files. In my opinion, this is one of the more lacking features in 
blender and I would love to see the plan for 2.8. I have my own 
controversial opinions of how I'd like to see it implemented, but I'll 
wait to see what Lukas says before I stir up the hornet's nest.

On 07/20/2015 11:28 AM, Jacob Merrill wrote:
> Linking / Dupligroups and instancing(true instancing) are all important in
> the movie, and game workflow,
>
> LibLoad / LibFree / LibNew are Extremely useful in game development and all
> need work.
>
>
>
> LibNew Fails to create new physics meshes during runtime at the moment, -
> https://developer.blender.org/T45360
>
> this is essential for 'Full' wrectified assemblies -
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8Ihb89lRR8&feature=youtu.be
>
> (right now it's limited to a central core with attachments)
>
>
> Also, Some ability to use leap motion/camera motion tracking/ position
> sensor data to animate a game actor, while recording keyframes, could allow
> real time acting
>
> with AR overlays like the shooting of Avatar, with things like google
> cardboard and occulus rift. and speed up animation
> considerably when multiple actors are concerned.
>
> On Mon, Jul 20, 2015 at 11:17 AM, David Fenner <d4vidfenner at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> This is great news. Blender really needs this. Congratulations for the
>> iniciative, really good. I'm personally most intrigued and excited about
>> linking workflow enchancements (local overrides, better proxies, etc), and
>> render layer workflows (more granular overrides).
>> I'm sure this road makes all blender programmers very happy, and I'm sure
>> this happinnes will be something good for users too.
>> You have all our support!!
>>
>> 2015-07-20 12:53 GMT-04:00 Lukas Tönne <lukas.toenne at gmail.com>:
>>
>>> I've started writing about the development and the problems we
>> encountered
>>> during the Cosmos Laundromat/Gooseberry production. These documents could
>>> be a good primer for devs who haven't done any development in a studio
>>> environment like the Blender Institute (like myself before this project).
>>>
>>> First is a general wiki doc summarizing all the major development and
>>> research topics. Only the section on hair systems is fleshed out atm, the
>>> rest will be added soon. The document is meant to give an overview and
>>> links to scientific papers for future reference, so each topic is handled
>>> only briefly.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Org:Institute/Open_projects/Gooseberry/SummaryLukas
>>> Out of all these diverse topics, the library linking system and its
>>> implications for pipeline and asset management have been a serious
>>> challenge. IMO the solutions we developed during the production, although
>>> they made the movie possible, are still not satisfying. Because this has
>>> been a problem in virtually every movie production since the invention of
>>> open movies, i thought it would help to start at the root and write a
>>> detailed examination. The following document is an attempt to build up
>> the
>>> complete picture from the basics (how movie production works) up to the
>>> existing situation in Blender and beyond. The proposal the end is not
>> final
>>> (!), finding a solid solution will require all the brains we can get.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1M_sjvt65ytN7VxDSZzvu3xwUImO8BYfuVbZ527Rqxp4/edit?usp=sharing
>>> Please excuse the shoddy formatting and unfinished state, i thought it
>>> better to release them early than let them collect dust.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Lukas
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jul 20, 2015 at 5:35 PM, Yuri Kovelenov <yuri at blend4web.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Ton,
>>>>
>>>> This sounds very exciting! Especially viewport, PBR and physics parts.
>>>> On our side we are ready to collaborate with Blender devs implementing
>>>> the proposed features and improving the existing functionality. We also
>>>> will be happy to participate in supporting the stable 2.7 branch. Will
>>>> it be possible to suggest some minor patches from our list [1] before
>>>> version 2.8 is available?
>>>>
>>>> Best regards,
>>>>
>>>> Yuri
>>>>
>>>> [1]
>>> http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:Doc/Projects/Blend4Web_proposals
>>>> On 20.07.2015 16:49, Ton Roosendaal wrote:
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> (also posted on http://code.blender.org)
>>>>> This is a proposal for work focus on blender.org for the coming
>> year.
>>>>> I've written this because we keep missing bigger development targets
>> -
>>>> we don't have enough time for larger projects. Instead too much time
>> goes
>>>> to releases, bug fixing, reviews, maintenance and support topics. The
>> bug
>>>> and patch tracker duties are keeping the best of our developers away
>> from
>>>> their own targets.  As a result we then don't have time for design
>> docs,
>>>> for planning, logs and in-depth sessions with the module teams, and
>> have
>>> no
>>>> time for the artists who are involved to make sure we're well aligned
>> and
>>>> know what to do. I think everyone has noticed that we're floating too
>>> much,
>>>> things are not clear. Where are we heading? Who does what, and how do
>> we
>>>> decide on things?
>>>>> So - it's time to act and gather the troops to refocus and get back
>>>> energy, to maximize involvement from everyone who's active in
>>> blender.org
>>>> and make sure Blender can survive for many more years.
>>>>> ----- Blender 2.8 - Workflow release -----
>>>>>
>>>>> Just like for 2.5, the proposal would be to take a bigger leap to a
>>>> bigger release by not releasing for a year. The 2.76 release then would
>>> be
>>>> the last 'real' version we do until 2.80 somewhere in 2016.
>>>>> Obviously, for the crucial fixes and smaller (stable) features we can
>>> do
>>>> update releases 2.77, 2.78 and 2.79.
>>>>> Topics to finish for 2.8 could be:
>>>>>
>>>>> - UI work: wrap up Python configurability project, make Workflow
>> based
>>>> configuring possible
>>>>>     Proof of concept: the stripped "Blender 101" for high school kids.
>>>>> - Viewport project, including a PBR quality engine/editor that could
>>>> replace BI and GE render.
>>>>> - A better designed integration of physics simulation in Blender
>>>>> - Invite the GE team to rethink game logic editing, to use viewport
>> and
>>>> new physics
>>>>> - Don't add the half finished Gooseberry targets but take the time
>>>> needed to code it well:
>>>>>       Particle nodes, hair nodes, simulation nodes, modifier nodes...
>>>>> - Asset managing and browsing, linking, references, external files in
>>>> general.
>>>>> - Integration in non Blender pipelines.
>>>>>
>>>>> Practical considerations:
>>>>>
>>>>> - Move development to special 2.8 branch(es)
>>>>> - Module teams are empowered to cleanup quite radically and get rid
>> of
>>>> legacy code.
>>>>> - The 2.8 series is allowed to be not 100% compatible with 2.7x.
>>>> (Physics, particles, games).
>>>>> - Spend time on organizing ourselves better, agreed designs should
>> lead
>>>> to more empowerment.
>>>>> And some core principles to agree on:
>>>>>
>>>>> - We reconfirm and where needed update the 2.5 spec docs.
>>>>> - Stick to existing Blender data structures and code design for as
>> much
>>>> as possible.
>>>>> - Make Blender ready to survive until 2020, but...
>>>>>       ... start collecting the list of bigger redesign issues we need
>> to
>>>> for a 3.0 project
>>>>> - Bring back the fun in Blender coding! :)
>>>>>
>>>>> The code.blender.org article for the roadmap of 2014-2015 is still
>>>> valid in my opinion. We just need to take a break of 9-12 months now,
>> to
>>>> make it work for real.
>>>>> Blender 2.8 Workflow Sprint
>>>>>
>>>>> In the coming months we can discuss and review the plans and make
>> sure
>>>> we're 100% aligned on the 2.8 targets and for other work during the
>>> coming
>>>> years. We should also meet and have good feedback sessions on it. So I
>>>> propose to use the Blender Conference in October as a deadline, and
>>>> organize a workshop in the week before.
>>>>> - Four days of workshops and design sessions, in the week before
>>> Blender
>>>> Conference.
>>>>> - Travel and hotel covered for by BF (and Dev Fund, or a new fund
>>>> raiser?)
>>>>> - We should try to get someone from every (active, involved) module
>>> team
>>>> on board. Also key user/contributors have to be on board. But it's also
>>>> more efficient to keep it compact.
>>>>> - Proposal: we do this invitation-only: First we invite the 5 most
>>>> active contributors of past years. Together they then invite persons
>>> more,
>>>> until we have 12 (?) people.
>>>>> - Sprint sessions can be in parallel too - UI, Viewport, Physics,
>> etc.
>>>> Let's make it public as good as possible.
>>>>> - The Sprint results get presented and reviewed during further on
>>>> sessions during the Blender Conference.
>>>>> Seven years ago, back in 2008, we also took a break of over a year,
>> to
>>>> get the 2.5 project started up. It was a very exciting period where a
>> lot
>>>> of new things were possible and could happen, even though we didn't
>>> finish
>>>> everything... it gave us quite a solid foundation to build on,
>>> attracting a
>>>> lot of new developers and great features.
>>>>> I realize we have to realistic now, not everything will possible. But
>>> we
>>>> also shouldn't stop dreaming up a good future for Blender. Let's take a
>>>> break from our demanding release cycle, rethink it all, but not for too
>>>> long. Let's cherish what we agree on and enjoy the freedom of a
>>>> configurable workflow that will enable you to do what you think is
>>> best...
>>>> for making 3d art, games, film and animation!
>>>>> Feedback very welcome!
>>>>>
>>>>> -Ton-
>>>>>
>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> Ton Roosendaal  -  ton at blender.org   -   www.blender.org
>>>>> Chairman Blender Foundation - Producer Blender Institute
>>>>> Entrepotdok 57A  -  1018AD Amsterdam  -  The Netherlands
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Bf-committers mailing list
>>>>> Bf-committers at blender.org
>>>>> http://lists.blender.org/mailman/listinfo/bf-committers
>>>> --
>>>> Yuri Kovelenov
>>>>
>>>> Development Lead
>>>> yuri at blend4web.com
>>>> +7 495 676 3660
>>>>
>>>> Blend4Web - an open source framework for creating 3D web apps
>>>> https://www.blend4web.com/en/
>>>> Triumph LLC | Moscow, Russian Federation
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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-- 
Jeffrey "Italic_" Hoover