[Bf-committers] FBX import support

[Ton Roosendaal]

Hi,

We already try to get Collada to work with Blender since it was released. At least a dozen coders worked on it, two or three GSoC projects were defined for it. Each time the maintainers give up.

For me Collada is legacy code - we can keep it around for stakeholders (2nd life), and if new stakeholders come in (mixamo?) they can also step in as a maintainer.

-Ton-

--------------------------------------------------------
Ton Roosendaal  -  ton at blender.org   -   www.blender.org
Chairman Blender Foundation - Producer Blender Institute
Entrepotdok 57A  -  1018AD Amsterdam  -  The Netherlands



On 25 Apr, 2014, at 15:05, Hadrien Brissaud wrote:

> Hello Ton and everyone,
> 
> I wouldn't say I know how these things work, but isn't user adoption
> precisely driven (or allowed) by software support in the first place ? Why
> wouldn't a development of Collada support be a wise investment ? It seems
> that supporting FBX through reverse-engineering is quite difficult. I
> understand the stakes, though : it *is* already a standard.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Hadrien
> 
> 
> On 25 April 2014 14:37, Ton Roosendaal <ton at blender.org> wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> The strong part of FBX was that it started as a native file format
>> (MotionBuilder). Autodesk then has been hacking a lot on top of it... so it
>> might have grown hairy and ugly, but it definitely works and gets used a
>> lot. It's a big shame that Autodesk refuses to make an open standard out of
>> it - even when only partially.
>> 
>> The alternative - Collada - is hardly an option either. When Collada got
>> published nobody was using it natively. Even after 5 years there's no
>> reference stakeholder to make sure the format has a decent user base and
>> momentum. And let's not start the discussion why a 3D media project would
>> use XML formatted text for 3d data...
>> 
>> What Alembic would offer - just baked meshes - is probably the best
>> future. Any serious attempt to match rigs, constraints and modifiers
>> between 3d apps is doomed anyway! :)
>> 
>> -Ton-
>> 
>> --------------------------------------------------------
>> Ton Roosendaal  -  ton at blender.org   -   www.blender.org
>> Chairman Blender Foundation - Producer Blender Institute
>> Entrepotdok 57A  -  1018AD Amsterdam  -  The Netherlands
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 25 Apr, 2014, at 8:47, <toni at playsign.net> <toni at playsign.net> wrote:
>> 
>>> This is why I’ve figured Collada may still be better to use -- at least
>> it is open and ~specified.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Does not seem like a good idea to build the future on something secret
>> (and ugly?) in the long run.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ~Toni
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> From: Bastien Montagne
>>> Sent: ‎Friday‎, ‎April‎ ‎25‎, ‎2014 ‎9‎:‎45‎ ‎AM
>>> To: bf-blender developers
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Tom said the essential. :)
>>> 
>>> We had to understand both the binary encoding[1] and format layout[2] of
>>> this ugly thing,
>>> and directly write from the py scripts… Highly frustrating and
>>> time-consuming tasks, esp.
>>> since FBX has some very odd inconsistencies and odd & picky expectations.
>>> 
>>> Note that armature and animation support on import side are on my TODO,
>>> just have to find
>>> some time for this, bugs are another frustrating and time consuming
>> task. :/
>>> 
>>> Bastien
>>> 
>>> [1]
>>> 
>> http://code.blender.org/index.php/2013/08/fbx-binary-file-format-specification/
>>> [2]
>>> 
>> http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/User:Mont29/Foundation/FBX_File_Structure
>>> (still heavy WIP).
>>> 
>>> On 25/04/2014 01:45, Tom M wrote:
>>>> The license for the FBX library is incompatible with the GPL, so not
>>>> it is not included.  The FBX importer and exporter are based on
>>>> reverse engineering the format.  The format is not documented.
>>>> 
>>>> LetterRip
>>>> 
>>>> On Thu, Apr 24, 2014 at 2:31 PM, Stefano Corazza <stefano at mixamo.com>
>> wrote:
>>>>> I hear there are improvements coming up... but many users are sending a
>>>>> lot of complaints about FBX import in Blender.
>>>>> 
>>>>> A few questions:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1 - Did we include in Blender the FBX SDK or otherwise how are these
>> FBX
>>>>> created?
>>>>> 
>>>>> 2 - Right now there is no support for rigged/animated characters in the
>>>>> FBX importer. Is this something anyone is working on?
>>>>> 
>>>>> FBX is a very complex format we have deeply studied in the past year, I
>>>>> just want to make sure we have a realistic vision of what is possible.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Please please please comment on this post!!!  We want to know!!!
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Stefano
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
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