[Bf-committers] Pupmenu conventions. (Was: CVScommit:blender/source/blender/src
edit.c)
John K. Walton
bf-committers@blender.org
Mon, 6 Oct 2003 12:11:42 -0400 (EDT)
On Mon, 6 Oct 2003, Ton Roosendaal wrote:
> Hi,
>
> The numerical hotkey option for menus is hardcoded in the menu system
> itself, it always works, and always counts from the top.
> This is so incredible simple & functional, that I'm really surprised
> someone thinks to drop that consistancy.
it's only consistant when you know about it :-) I thrive on htis
kind of 'muscle memory trick' to reduce brainwork in UI's. in fact
all my passwords are easier to remember with the muscle memory
trick (and I have to have a LOT of passwords in life).
> The return event code for 'knife tool' (11) has nothing to do with it.
>
> The Wkey menu in Blender is the worst example to look at... I've added
> it a long time ago to have easy access to new options we coded, it has
> no meaning, nor it was thought out to be a major hotkey. Only: "If it
> doesn't fit anywhere, put it in the Wkey menu!"
what's dutch for 'w' :-)
> Should be replaced with the 'context toolbox'.
>
> -Ton-
>
>
>
>
> On Monday, Oct 6, 2003, at 15:32 Europe/Amsterdam, Robert Wenzlaff
> wrote:
>
> > On Monday 06 October 2003 08:10 am, Stephen Swaney wrote:
> >> So basically, I agree with you about oranizing the menus like
> >> pulldowns,
> >> and the space and w pupmenus. But leave the darn snap menu alone.
> >> Design principles are good, but don't follow them blindly.
> >
> > That's the whole point. You can have it BOTH ways. You can
> > re-orgainize the
> > menu, and STILL use SHIFT-S-4. The only thing we loose is the fact
> > that the
> > 4th item is always invoked by a "4". But because we gain visible
> > feedback
> > (there will be a bold "4" in the button text), IMHO, it's better than
> > the old
> > "counting from the top" system.
> >
> > I bet there's a number of long time users that didn't realize numbers
> > worked
> > in menus. I only became aware of that in the last month or so, and
> > I've been
> > around since 1.72. Why? There's no feedback for that feature. Even
> > if I had
> > read about it somewhere, it didn't stick, because I never used it.
> > And I
> > never used it, because it didn't stick. Seeing it in bold everytime a
> > pupmenu comes up, will make it stick. New users can become power users
> > faster.
> >
> > Since you stated that the advantage of the current system was that you
> > didn't
> > have to look at the menu, would you even notice if (hypotheically)
> > Cursor->Grid were no longer the 4th from the top, if it were still
> > invoked
> > with a "4", because it had been changed to "Cursor->Grid (*4*), where
> > *x*
> > indicates bold or underline. (BTW, The Shift-S menu IS context
> > sensitive.
> > It changes, for example, in the IPO window.)
> >
> > So a year from now, we can insert Gri*b*nets->Grid before Cursor->Grid
> > (*4*)
> > (because the magical properties of Gribnets dictates that it logically
> > goes
> > there), and the Gribnets becomes Shift-S-B (The number of G's in that
> > menu
> > makes "*G*ribnets->Grid" a bad choice), while "Cursor->Grid (*4*)"
> > STAYS
> > SHIFT-S-4. And both combos are clear to the users who still look at
> > the menu
> > because the hot keys are in highlighted text. It's the best of all
> > worlds.
> > (And if it's feasable it might be "C*u*rsor->Grid (*4*)" and be
> > invoked by
> > either key.)
> >
> > ( If you're English isn't so good, don't be flustered by "Gribnets"
> > It's
> > word I made up to represent a feature not yet written.)
> >
> > You will note that I tried to emulate part of this by placing Knife
> > Subd. in
> > the middle of the W menu, but making it event "11". I didn't know, at
> > the
> > time, it was breaking convention, and I haven't bothered fixing it
> > because
> > it's going to the new "K" menu soon.
> >
> > I'm not saying that the snap-menu NEEDS changing just for the sake of
> > change,
> > but having conventions that force you to not change it, no matter how
> > illogical it becomes in the future, is silly. And at some point the
> > logic
> > becomes overwhelming and the combo gets broken anyway (Ton's
> > exceptions).
> > Then it's even harder to adjust to, because you've been using it for
> > that
> > much longer.
> >
> > The convention was to be that the digits (1-9) be reserved for "famous"
> > hot-key combos (since letters don't currently work in pupmenus, they
> > are not
> > part of any famous combos).
> > --
> > ***********************************************
> > "Obscure, Profound it was, and Nebulous,
> > So that by fixing on it's depths my sight,
> > Nothing whatsoever I discerned therein."
> >
> > -Dante, predicting the Windows 95 API.
> > ***********************************************
> > Robert Wenzlaff rwenzlaff@soylent-green.com
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Bf-committers mailing list
> > Bf-committers@blender.org
> > http://www.blender.org/mailman/listinfo/bf-committers
> >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
> Ton Roosendaal Blender Foundation ton@blender.org
> http://www.blender.org
>
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