<div dir="ltr"><div>Hi,</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks for writing down the discussion. If I understand it correctly I agree about the UI data and scene data distinction, and so a distinction between layers and plates.</div><div><br></div><div>On the scene data side I think you need object layers (or groups) for organizing scene data, and render layers for decomposing the scene so it can be manipulated and recomposed in a compositor. A render layer may also produce multiple passes / AOVs. I've explained my view in more detail in the layer manager task and don't want to start a layer discussion here, but it's all related of course.</div><div><br></div><div>In the viewport you could display the entire scene, one specific render layer, and ideally also the output of the compositor recomposing multiple render layers. The viewport would draw things like widgets or selection outlines on top of that. It would also give control over filtering out certain types of objects or shading objects in some way that's different than the final render.</div><div><br></div><div>To some extent such viewport options duplicate render layer options, but I think it make sense to be able to use e.g. a matcap for sculpting while using a different material in the final render, or to temporarily hide all hair in the viewport but not disable it in the final render. It's tempting to unify things here but mixing UI and scene data is problematic.</div><div><br></div><div>We want the viewport to be extensible, and modern realtime rendering often works in multiple passes, and I guess that's where the concept of plates comes into it. In my opinion the details of how this works should be hidden from the user. From the user point of view plates could add extra viewport options, and tasks may contain presets of such viewport options. But what exactly a plate is should not be known to the user, it should be whatever is needed to make the API work best for developers.</div><div><br></div><div>Regards,</div><div>Brecht.</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Sep 30, 2016 at 9:35 PM, Dalai Felinto <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:dfelinto@gmail.com" target="_blank">dfelinto@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace;display:inline"></div><font face="courier new, monospace">Hi,</font><div><font face="courier new, monospace"><br></font></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace">I had an informal meeting last Wednesday with Ton regarding the proposed design (after it was posted on <a href="http://code.blender.org" target="_blank">code.blender.org</a>), as well as the next steps.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace">You can read the write up of the discussion here (2 pages only)<span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"></span></div></div><div><div class="gmail_chip gmail_drive_chip" style="width:396px;height:18px;max-height:18px;background-color:#f5f5f5;padding:5px;color:#222;font-family:arial;font-style:normal;font-weight:bold;font-size:13px;border:1px solid #ddd;line-height:1"><a href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/1xQUIg8OsIfRTCu0Qd2FqhtPnlYk2F-HjaYaOHV6hXUA/edit?usp=drive_web" style="display:inline-block;overflow:hidden;text-overflow:ellipsis;white-space:nowrap;text-decoration:none;padding:1px 0px;border:none;width:100%" target="_blank"><img style="vertical-align:bottom;border:none" src="https://ssl.gstatic.com/docs/doclist/images/icon_11_document_list.png"> <span dir="ltr" style="color:#15c;text-decoration:none;vertical-align:bottom">Blender 2.8 Viewport Meeting - 16.09.28</span></a></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace;display:inline"></div></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace;display:inline">(</div><span style="font-family:"courier new",monospace">I'll leave on google.docs for now in case someone wants to make inline comments there</span><span style="font-family:"courier new",monospace"><div class="gmail_default" style="display:inline">)</div></span><br></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace">It should shed some light on how the features presented in <a href="http://code.blender.org" target="_blank">code.blender.org</a> can fit in the paradigm of layer management and data design.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace">It should also address Brecht's questions on different edit-modes in different viewports. Basically although it may have been possible (or so Sergey told me), we will keep this aspect of Blender how it is now.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace"><br></div></div><span class=""><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace">> I'm just wondering, how will freestyle fit into the new viewport/render?</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace"><br></div></span><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace">It really depends on the Freestyle code, which I haven't looked at. It would be incredible to have it working in the viewport, but it may require too many changes to its code (I think freestyle is not designed for realtime pipelines).</div><span class=""><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace">Regards,</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:"courier new",monospace">Dalai</div><div class="gmail_default"><div class="gmail_default"><font face="courier new, monospace">--</font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font face="courier new, monospace"><a href="http://blendernetwork.org/dalai-felinto" target="_blank">blendernetwork.org/dalai-<wbr>felinto</a></font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font face="courier new, monospace"><a href="http://www.dalaifelinto.com" target="_blank">www.dalaifelinto.com</a></font></div></div></span></div>
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