<div dir="ltr">I want to put the option for how to measure bevel width (the tool's 'Amount Type') into the modifier. Before I do, I wondered what people think the default method should be? The old method (and what is assumed by models with bevel modifier in files pre 2.70) is the 'Offset' method. I can see the argument for making the 'Width' method the default. Have people here tried both extensively enough to have an opinion?<div>
<br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Nov 10, 2013 at 7:34 AM, Howard Trickey <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:howard.trickey@gmail.com" target="_blank">howard.trickey@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">OK, revision 61221 has these changes. Let's play with them some before putting them in the modifier, since that will affect what is saved in .blend files.<div>
<br></div></div><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Nov 10, 2013 at 5:36 AM, Howard Trickey <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:howard.trickey@gmail.com" target="_blank">howard.trickey@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">If there are no opinions on my suggestions for naming methods, I think I'm going to go with them and commit the change. Reminder: will change UI to say "Amount " instead if "Offset", and have a dropdown type with choices:<div>
Offset</div><div>Width</div><div>Height</div><div>Depth</div><div><br></div><div>I think I will go with Offset as the default, since that is what users are used to, and existing models with modifiers will have been using that method. Also checked Wings3D just now and that's what it uses for its (only) method. Respond now if you think we should make 'Width' the default.</div>
</div><div><div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Nov 8, 2013 at 7:43 PM, metalliandy <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:metalliandy666@googlemail.com" target="_blank">metalliandy666@googlemail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
Hi Howard,<div><br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">We can talk about adding inset-extrude like
capabilities to Bevel later (I'm not convinced this is the right
place for it -- why not in the inset tool itself?) </blockquote>
<br></div>
Ahh, I didnt mean that we add inset extrude capabilities to Bevel. I
meant that we should add the interactive 3d viewport control handles
that were in the Inset Extrude addon as they were super intuitive to
use and much better then using the tool properties.<br>
<br>
<a href="http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Extensions:2.6/Py/Scripts/Modeling/Inset-Extrude" target="_blank">http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Extensions:2.6/Py/Scripts/Modeling/Inset-Extrude</a><br>
<br>
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPes27n2pIk" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPes27n2pIk</a><br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
-Andy<div><div><br>
<br>
<div>On 08/11/2013 23:24, Howard Trickey
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">We can talk about adding inset-extrude like
capabilities to Bevel later (I'm not convinced this is the right
place for it -- why not in the inset tool itself?) For now I
want to fix the Bevel bugs and make it so that people will stop
saying "it's just broken". So I want to concentrate on base
bevel functionality first.
<div>
<br>
</div>
<div>For names of these different modes, how about these:</div>
<div>Across Face -> Inset or Offset</div>
<div>Across New Face -> Width</div>
<div>Angle Bisector -> Depth</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Would those make more sense to you Jonathan?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Nov 8, 2013 at 5:14 PM,
metalliandy <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:metalliandy666@googlemail.com" target="_blank">metalliandy666@googlemail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> Yes! That's the one
:)<br>
<br>
Cheers!<br>
<br>
-Andy
<div>
<div><br>
<br>
<div>On 08/11/2013 21:27, Jonathan Williamson wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Andy, are you thinking of Inset
Extrude for the interactivity? </div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">Jonathan Williamson
<div><a href="http://cgcookie.com" target="_blank">http://cgcookie.com</a></div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Nov 8, 2013 at
3:25 PM, metalliandy <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:metalliandy666@googlemail.com" target="_blank">metalliandy666@googlemail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> Hey
guys,<br>
<br>
I think the main requirement for a decent
bevel is that by default the result would be
as even as possible with the same angle
& width being obtained wherever
possible. Hard surface modelling is made
much harder by inconsistent bevel widths so
I would vode for the 'Along New Face' option
too.<br>
That being said current functionality should
be retained of course as flexibility is the
key to robust modelling tools. :)<br>
<br>
I would also like the interactive control
handles in the 3d viewport from the old
inset script to make a comeback and be added
to the bevel (and inset while we are at it
;) ), though the name of the addon alludes
me atm. Perhaps Jonathan remembers the one I
mean? If not I will find it out later and
post it.<br>
<br>
For the naming I would use amount or
percentage vs fraction too. I think they
would make much more sense to artists in
general. <br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
-Andy
<div>
<div><br>
<br>
<div>On 08/11/2013 19:54, Jonathan
Williamson wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Hey Howard,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I think these options would be
very valuable. I know that in my
work I would generally prefer the
<b>Along New Face </b>option. I
also see the <b>Along the
Bisector </b>option to be quite
valuable for when you want to
chamfer a specific amount. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As for naming, I think <b>Amount
</b>is a better name. Offset to me
means distance shifted from
center. Whereas while beveling
what I care about is the "amount
of beveling". </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Percentage is consistent with
other areas of Blender I believe,
and so I suggest leaving that as
is. I don't know of anywhere that
uses "Fraction".</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As for naming of the methods,
I'm not sure. I don't particularly
like the existing naming, as it
doesn't clearly explain the method
to me. But I cannot currently
think of a better alternative. If
I think of something I'll let you
know.</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">Jonathan Williamson
<div><a href="http://cgcookie.com" target="_blank">http://cgcookie.com</a></div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Nov
8, 2013 at 1:45 PM, Howard Trickey
<span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:howard.trickey@gmail.com" target="_blank">howard.trickey@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">I have now
triaged and about to attack
the bevel bugs in tracker.
<div><br>
<div>A number of them are
really feature requests,
in that they want an
algorithm that does
something different than
what the bevel algorithm
does today (and there are
reasons for why it does
what it does today). I'd
like to start a discussion
of what bevel should
really do -- where it
should change what it does
today, and where we should
just add more options.</div>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>E.g., see <a>https://projects.blender.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=34504&group_id=9&atid=498</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>A start of what will
eventually become the
developer documentation for
the bevel code is here:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a>http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/User:Howardt/Bevel</a><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>This start is about how
does one measure the 'bevel
amount' (currently called
'offset' in the interface).
Please read. You can see
that there are 4
alternatives, each with
something to recommend
themselves. I propose (and
have already implemented,
but not submitted) giving
all 4 options to the user,
with 'Along Face' the
default.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Questions for this list:</div>
<div>- Is this a good idea?
Should I submit it?</div>
<div>- Are there better names
for the methods?</div>
<div>- Should I change the
name 'offset' in the
interface to something else
('amount', maybe?); it would
be kind of annoying to
change the code at this
point, since the field
persisted in .blends is
called 'offset'.</div>
<div>- Should 'Percentage'
perhaps be 'Fraction'? I
don't remember what is
common in Blender, to enter
such numbers as between 0
and 100, or between 0.0 and
1.0. One problem with
leaving it as Percentage is
that the numbers are way out
of range with the numbers
used for the other three
methods, and I probably have
to figure out how to scale
the interactive number
differently when Percentage
is used. So I would prefer
this to be 'Fraction'.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>There are other questions
about how to deal with
problems when all
constraints can't be met
(when beveling several edges
together); and more about
the algorithm used to fill
in rounded corners; I'll
fill in the discussion about
those later.</div>
<span><font color="#888888">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>- Howard</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</font></span></div>
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